Copyrights ?? Ask the Author ?

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Sensible-Sound
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Copyrights ?? Ask the Author ?

Post by Sensible-Sound »

hi there,

i have an question.
when you start writing a remix, do you first a ensure the permission of the original author to cover a song ? is it necessary ?
am i a criminal if i do not so ? surely i am never pretending other ones songs to be my idea *sorry for my bad english btw ;)*
did of you ask for permission ?
i am thinking of writing an remix an hesitate to contact the author and also did not even know the emai-adress of the author.

thanks for feedback

daniel
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Post by Chris Abbott »

Officially you don't have to ask permission if the treatment is similar to the original as long as licence fees are paid for commercial usage,
but you have to ask permission in other cases.

Unofficially, as long as the piece isn't used for commercial use, then
you can do anything you like without permission.

What are you intending to cover? It might be something I can give
you permission for anyway.

Chris
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Post by Sensible-Sound »

Hi Chris,

thx for your answer.
although it was covered several times i want to cover green beret subtune 10 and parallax subtune 2 :)
since my first try to cover a song (bomb jack 2) wasn't a real remix (..and due to this rejected at remix org)i am now trying to make some real remix-stuff and there came the thought of : ups? what about copyrights ? ;-)
if you don't can give me the permission perhaps you have an contact to martin galway?

thx and regards

daniel
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Post by Chris Abbott »

It's OK, you can have permission to upload both to RKO, with mine and
Martin's blessing.

Chris
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Post by Lagerfeldt »

Actually to explain things further:

A remix is not the same as a cover version. A remix should by defintion include at least one original part of the original song (most Kwed "remixes" are actually more like "remakes" with a bit of re-arranging).

When truly remixing, the need for two separate copyright permits arises: One from the composer (and/or publishing firm) - since a remix usually changes the original arrangement of parts* - and another one from the company and/or person who owns the reproduction rights to the actual reproduction of the song. In the case of C64 music it means that even though the composer and/or publishing company owns or controls the song writing they do not usually own the actual sound "recording", so to speak (this would be the actual sound being played by a C64). This is owned by the software company who bought the song and paid the composer for its inclusion in a game.

This fact translates to: you only need a permission from the composer/publishing firm if you cover/copy the music, not using parts of the original song playing on a C64. However, if you sample or record the song or part of the song from a C64 you will need to clear the use with the software company who bought the song from the composer (unless the composer has a written agreement that stipulates that he still retains the reproduction rights to his work - very very seldom).

I don't think this has never been tested in a court of law. But since the SID chip is actually producing the sound a software company could have trouble convincing the judge a SID song it constitutes a "recording" on par with a cd (for which the law was made). On the other hand they could make a good case arguing that the SID file (or piece of code in a C64) is the cd/media, and the C64 or PC/Emu is merely the cd player (medium) so to speak. This would give the software company control over the actual sound of that particular song as reproduced by a C64 or C64 emulator.

Usually the use of samples is paid for in cash fees and sometimes royalties of sales on top, while covering a song is always and exclusively paid for via mechanical/performance royalties.

*In the case of a cover version (a 1:1 version) of the song, it is not necessary to ask for permission (only in very rare case of people who have not joined the official or semi-official organizations like ASCAP, NCB, BIEM etc. - it did actually happen to us once, lost £100.000 in a lawsuit -ugh!) as long as you do not change any melody lines or words, and adhere to the original song structure. This means you can't do lyrics like "I'm a Barbie Boy in a Barbie World" or put a chorus in the beginning of your Britney Spears "One More Time..." cover version if it doesn't have one in the first place. You may however put extra choruses in the end of the song if it ends with a chorus. Ad libbing is allowed but within reason, e.g. you can't change the melody line completely claiming it's just vivid ad libbing.

For cover versions a so called statutory copyright license is issued. This also means that once you've made an original song of yours available for the public through the radio and on a commercial cd, anybody can make a cover version as long as they don't use it for political, religious, sexual or advertising purposes.

Of course you are paid both mechanical and performance royalties for this.

In theory, the fact that RKO isn't commercial as such doesn't mean it's actually legal to make and upload these remixes unless you have the permission from each author.

In real life though, it's okay with C64 music unless you use it commerically. However commercial use is of course encouraged since it would generate money for the original authors and the publishing company .

On a final note, it is sometimes enough to ask the publishing company only and they will grant you the permission but depending on the contract a composer might have sometime to say too. So be sure to check that the publishing company has a clause in their contracts that enable them to act on behalf of the composer.
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Post by Sensible-Sound »

thx again :)

@chris:didn't know you have the right to give me the permission of remixing some galway-songs,although i know you are one of the main carriers of the scene. i feel better now ;) i guess it will take me 2-3 month to finish the remixes.

@lagerfeldt: thanks for your in depth describition of the situation.that was really helpful :)
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Post by Chris Abbott »

> thanks for your in depth describition of the situation.that was
> really helpful
Yup, it was very comprehensive.

I do in fact have the correct clauses to be able to grant permissions:
and of course LF is correct: in theory RKO should be paying royalties
for every download, even if it's free (or paying a subscription),
but no one's going to enforce that, since it would be a manifestly
nasty and un-community-like thing to do, and would close the site.

<<<
even though the composer and/or publishing company owns or controls the song writing they do not usually own the actual sound "recording", so to speak (this would be the actual sound being played by a C64). This is owned by the software company who bought the song and paid the composer for its inclusion in a game.
>>>
Actually most of the freelancers insist they only granted licences to use
the code on a specific platform, so they (and so I) still own the
phonographic rights. Martin and Ben have also asserted their claim to
this too, primarily on the basis that no one else has a better claim
backed up by paperwork :)

<<<
unless the composer has a written agreement that stipulates that he still retains the reproduction rights to his work - very very seldom
>>>
Transfer of any kind of rights have to be in writing, so it's actually up
to the software company to prove ownership of anything. Basically
no one signed contracts back then, which is good for the authors.
It would be a lot different for Amiga music.

Chris
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Post by Sensible-Sound »

nice to see this forum is working,since i am almost new here ;)
thanks to you both :)
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Post by Lagerfeldt »

Chris Abbott wrote:> thanks for your in depth describition of the situation.that was
> really helpful
Yup, it was very comprehensive.

I do in fact have the correct clauses to be able to grant permissions:
and of course LF is correct: in theory RKO should be paying royalties
for every download, even if it's free (or paying a subscription),
but no one's going to enforce that, since it would be a manifestly
nasty and un-community-like thing to do, and would close the site.

<<<
even though the composer and/or publishing company owns or controls the song writing they do not usually own the actual sound "recording", so to speak (this would be the actual sound being played by a C64). This is owned by the software company who bought the song and paid the composer for its inclusion in a game.
>>>
Actually most of the freelancers insist they only granted licences to use
the code on a specific platform, so they (and so I) still own the
phonographic rights. Martin and Ben have also asserted their claim to
this too, primarily on the basis that no one else has a better claim
backed up by paperwork :)

<<<
unless the composer has a written agreement that stipulates that he still retains the reproduction rights to his work - very very seldom
>>>
Transfer of any kind of rights have to be in writing, so it's actually up
to the software company to prove ownership of anything. Basically
no one signed contracts back then, which is good for the authors.
It would be a lot different for Amiga music.

Chris
Yes you are correct, I suppose nobody bothered to write any contracts in those days.
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Post by Chris Abbott »

> Yes you are correct, I suppose nobody bothered to write any
> contracts in those days.

They didn't :) It's shocking isn't it?
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Post by Vosla »

... and this is how you ended up with all the rights for most c64 songs in your hands, chris? :D
though really competent hands you own.
lucky for us all. :)
All is lost.
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Post by tas »

He's had twins, so obviously he needn't have used his competent hands :)
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Post by Vosla »

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
All is lost.
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Post by Larsec »

Tas wrote:He's had twins, so obviously he needn't have used his competent hands :)
...
<--- I went that way --->
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