Better Amiga music?

DaveT · Post by **DaveT** » 22/05/2004 - 12:08

Hi there!

This will probably stirr things up a bit but I have a question... with so many absolutely amazing Amiga tunes waiting to be converted to todays more demanding quality standards why choose lesser/weaker/clichÃƒÂ© tunes?
I'm not saying the remixers here have bad taste but I mean, why choose tunes from games (that actually weren't that good probably) and remix them? I know, there are memories and good times associated with the tunes but does that really justify a remix?
Take Shadow of the beast or Turrican for instance... the music is very good and very well known but does it really need any more treatment?
I know there's always a new interpretaion of the tune and they probably deserve it, but unless it's going to be better thatn what's available, what's the point?? I mean, can't get any better than Chris Huelsbeck own remixes, right?

The C64 remix scene has probably been around for a while longer so some remixes already stand out more (of the 2564 available Delta remixes) but I feel that the Amiga music scene isn't beeing treated as it should. One day I had this conversation and someone told me Amiga tunes were and ARE good so they don't actually need/improve with remixes. That's partly true...
Out of all the remixes here I only found a measly few really oustanding as they captured the original feeling and somehow WITHOUT beeing butchered beyond recognition actually felt like the first time I heard them! It's the way I thing this music should be treated.
Take one example: Feekzoid's The desert dream... it's amazing! If you take the time to compare the original tune and the remix it's a brilliant work really... All the sound the Amiga couln't possibly produce but coupled with the powerfullness the music conveied really stand out among the others... we need MORE like this!!
Enigma (TiP), Space Debris, Back from Blue, Sweet Dreams, Elysium, Hold the Line, MechDreams, Biorhythms,and many stuff from 4Mat, Jogeir, Laxity, Jesper kid, Jester, Bruno, Azazel, Ellwood, Necros, Rymix, Sidewinder...and so many others... why, oh why, venture into the common stuff when there's so many special stuff out there.
FeekZoid, DHS, Pytzi...I love your work (both on the C64 and here) but can you please do more like these?
Take a minute or two to listen to some examples I gave and you'll see the greatness that lies waiting for some of you to explore!!
No disrespect for waht's been done but so far I'm a little disapointed...

Your's truly,

Dave

Edit: I'm not saying 1:1 editions are better... but it's nice when you can actually recognize the music... otherwise why not create new tunes? There's so many possibilities out there while remaining faithfull... MachinaeSupremacy Sidology tunes come to mind...

Makke · Post by **Makke** » 22/05/2004 - 12:37

A big difference between C64 music and Amiga music is that the C64 music leaves a lot more things to the imagination and open for enterpritation. Many Amiga tracks already have a fixed sound and genre. It takes more to break through that barier and do something creative with it.

The problem for me personally with remixing Amiga tracks is that I either want to have the exact same sound as the original (with better quality of course) or I want to redo it completely. The two Amiga remixes on AmigaRemix that I have done is pretty much the same as the original, with an updated sound, plus the advantage of more channels makes it possible to add more bits and pieces.

If I, for example, were to remix Jester's Stardust Memories I'd be facing a big problem, because part of what I love with that track is the choice of sounds. So if I was remixing it I'd want to stay as close as possible to the original. This is very hard to do. Finding the right sounds is not only time consuming, it's also very very boring. Thus I don't do it.

I do agree with you on the over all quality of Amiga remixes though. It's nowhere near the quality of many C64 remixes, I often find myself listening to Amiga remixes going "No! Don't do THAT!" But since the Amiga remix community is a lot smaller than, for example the C64 one, there are fewer releases. Fewer releases mean even fewer who're extraordinarily excellent.

DaveT wrote:I know, there are memories and good times associated with the tunes but does that really justify a remix?

What better reason to justify a remix than reviving old memories?

DaveT wrote:I mean, can't get any better than Chris Huelsbeck own remixes, right?

That is a problem with Turrican (and other HÃƒÂ¼lsbeck-Amiga stuff), he's already done the ultimate remixes of them

DaveT wrote:Take one example: Feekzoid's The desert dream... it's amazing!

If everyone was as good as FeekZoid...we'd all be very good. Uhm...yeah.

DaveT · Post by **DaveT** » 22/05/2004 - 13:03

Exactly. Although I admit that finding the sounds that fit/improve the quality of the music without altering it may be hard to do isn't the original worth it?
That's my point exactly... unless you just want to do substandard stuff or flakey tunes, don't the amiga musics DESERVE a good treatment?
If the original can't be improved then why bother? One fundamental aspect of amiga tunes was the balance and the limitation of channels that made some tunes off-balanced and appear "cut" trhough the song wich is unacceptable by today's standards (I'm referring to mod's not Xm's/S3ms). To fill in the gaps is ok by me IF the sound gets purified and well balanced...actually the Feekzoid tune reminds me of that...
Oh, and when I meant the memories to justify a remix, I mean a bad tune to begin with... sometimes the gameplay and fun make up for a medium quality song... and you don't even realise it...

Feekzoid · Post by **Feekzoid** » 22/05/2004 - 13:04

:O

You guys ;)

Thanks for the compliments. I have a few Amiga tunes that I'd like to do - including some of my own - but I find them quite hard to approach. eg. I've gotten requests to cover the other main two tracks in Desert Dream, but I dont know what to do with them since to my ears they are already perfection (like what Makke said above) so I'm afraid to touch them!

Tends to be the more melodic mods I think that can be remixed/arranged succesfully, tunes where the Amiga simply did not have enough channels to give an instrument room to breathe.

Makke · Post by **Makke** » 22/05/2004 - 14:37

DaveT wrote:To fill in the gaps is ok by me IF the sound gets purified and well balanced...

Yes, it bothers me a bit when samples from the original tune is used in the remix. The original samples are 8 bit 22 kHz at best. Then the remix is not a complete remake and update in sound, it's more like a Windows patch.

A few gaps are being filled and a few things fixed, but the core of the tune is exactly the same.

FeekZoid wrote:Tends to be the more melodic mods I think that can be remixed/arranged succesfully, tunes where the Amiga simply did not have enough channels to give an instrument room to breathe.

Very much so. The more focused the original is on melody, the less you have to take into account which sounds to use. Like the Desert Dream MOD's rely a lot on the sound as well as the melody. I mean, what would Desert Dream tune 3 (To Zeus Pet) be without the "Ooo-aaa-eee-aaa"-bit? Perfect example of where the sounds used make a big difference.

Matrix · Post by **Matrix** » 22/05/2004 - 15:57

Makke is absolutely right here, since the 64 was digital synthysis, its far more open to interpretation; with amiga mods you have to get exactly the same sound, that the original IFF was sampled from for it to be really effective.

That said, im currently working on Phenomena/Enigma (so odd you mention that) as well as a remix of the main theme from amiga's "Chuck Rock".

Matrix · Post by **Matrix** » 22/05/2004 - 15:59

I've gotten requests to cover the other main two tracks in Desert Dream, but I dont know what to do with them since to my ears they are already perfection (like what Makke said above) so I'm afraid to touch them!

- Dont forget Feek, Kefrens themselves have as much as asked you to remix the rest of Desert Dreams lol .... THEY LOVE YOUR STUFF !! - In short what was said over IM was that your first mix gave them perfect faith in your ability to acurately convey the rest without making a total hash of the job. And for the record, theyre really looking forward to hearing what u can do

Matrix · Post by **Matrix** » 22/05/2004 - 16:02

I mean, what would Desert Dream tune 3 (To Zeus Pet) be without the "Ooo-aaa-eee-aaa"-bit? Perfect example of where the sounds used make a big difference.

- Or the game GODS ..... "Waahh Ey Waahh-Ah ..... Waahh Ey Waahh-Ah ..... Wah-ah .... Tick , dum dum dum, Into ......... The wonderful.......... dum dum dum..........Into ......... The wonderful. OOOEEEE oooeeeee TIK TIK TIK *repeat*"

Makke · Post by **Makke** » 22/05/2004 - 20:07

Matrix wrote:- Or the game GODS ..... "Waahh Ey Waahh-Ah ..... Waahh Ey Waahh-Ah ..... Wah-ah .... Tick , dum dum dum, Into ......... The wonderful.......... dum dum dum..........Into ......... The wonderful. OOOEEEE oooeeeee TIK TIK TIK *repeat*"

Indeed. Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful, wonderful, ...

Feekzoid · Post by **Feekzoid** » 23/05/2004 - 12:02

Matrix wrote:
I've gotten requests to cover the other main two tracks in Desert Dream, but I dont know what to do with them since to my ears they are already perfection (like what Makke said above) so I'm afraid to touch them!
- Dont forget Feek, Kefrens themselves have as much as asked you to remix the rest of Desert Dreams lol .... THEY LOVE YOUR STUFF !! - In short what was said over IM was that your first mix gave them perfect faith in your ability to acurately convey the rest without making a total hash of the job. And for the record, theyre really looking forward to hearing what u can do :)

Feek as Tweek from Southpark:

"TOO MUCH PRESSSSSURE!"

lol ;)

I'll see what I can do.

Suffice to say that tune 3 will have its "oooooaaaaeeeeeooooaaaaa" lifted straight from it, possibly tweaked or filtered.

Rather than me myself do an "ooooaaaaaeeeeeeeeooooooo" vocoded.

...hmmm...

A blend of the two might actually be cool....

hmmm.

*gets to work*

putzi · Post by **putzi** » 28/05/2004 - 1:01

DaveT wrote: FeekZoid, DHS, Pytzi...I love your work (both on the C64 and here) but can you please do more like these?

Oh my God! Someone who likes my remixes

DHS · Post by **DHS** » 28/05/2004 - 10:47

putzi wrote:
DaveT wrote: FeekZoid, DHS, Pytzi...I love your work (both on the C64 and here) but can you please do more like these?
Oh my God! Someone who likes my remixes

He wrote Pytzi, not Putzi

Feekzoid · Post by **Feekzoid** » 28/05/2004 - 11:50

Off topic... but Putzi.... is there a high res shot of that cat pic anywhere?

Bloody funny

Matrix · Post by **Matrix** » 28/05/2004 - 17:35

http://limecat.net/

putzi · Post by **putzi** » 28/05/2004 - 20:39

DHS wrote:
putzi wrote:
DaveT wrote: FeekZoid, DHS, Pytzi...I love your work (both on the C64 and here) but can you please do more like these?
Oh my God! Someone who likes my remixes
He wrote Pytzi, not Putzi

Oh right! So no-one likes my remixes

Better Amiga music?

Better Amiga music?

Re: Better Amiga music?

Re: Better Amiga music?

Re: Better Amiga music?

Re: Better Amiga music?