Commodore Remix

hi guys,

well, it's only been up for a short while, but my latest remix Super Monsterboy in Wonderland looks like its gonna go down like a sack o' sh**.

I understand its probably not to everyone's tastes, but if it really is *that* bad, would a few of you mind giving me some constructive criticism as to why?

I admit, i'm just a little dissapointed, since i had real fun writing that one, and i like listening to it myself, but i suppose it is only early days.

thanks in advance to anyone who takes an interest!

Well, first off (and I've only just listened to it thanks to this post, since I don't remember enough Amiga tunes, never having had one properly)...

The instruments you're using seem like this:

1) Two square wave lead instruments (taken from original?)
2) One square wave bassline
3) Some drums
4) Some sample/hold bassline that appears occasionally
So I think you've got here:

1) The source material sounds pretty bad to me.
2) The reverb is on everything, and is way harsh. If you want soft, use timed delays.
3) The piece doesn't develop over time, though you did bother to put in a break of sorts.
4) There's nothing in there musically that you did except maybe the drums.
5) The bass isn't bassy enough, and all the instruments sound far away and unpleasant.

Suggestions would all revolve around more musical content, better mixing, better EQ, better sample choices, better FX... and if you want to make this into a drum and bass tune, then study proper drum and bass artists and what they're doing.

Chris

let me just say thanks for the response Chris, its appriciated.
with regards to your comments i've the following to say;

Chris Abbott wrote:The instruments you're using seem like this:

1) Two square wave lead instruments (taken from original?)
2) One square wave bassline
3) Some drums
4) Some sample/hold bassline that appears occasionally

as i mentioned in the "about" section... (1) yes, that *is* the original lead line (which doubles up at times), and (4) a couple of (real - i might add - not sampled) roland tb-303 lines.

Chris Abbott wrote: 1) The source material sounds pretty bad to me.

ok, but in what sense? Musically *i* really like it, and as far as the sound quality goes, it is 8-bit sourced, which IMO gives it that retro charm.

2) The reverb is on everything, and is way harsh. If you want soft, use timed delays.

the lead line uses timed delays, whilst there's reverb used to space the snare (a usual technique) and i made the 303 line's reverb quite wet to give them that old-school-techno sound. timed delays on these would, i think, cloud the sound more.

3) The piece doesn't develop over time, though you did bother to put in a break of sorts.
4) There's nothing in there musically that you did except maybe the drums.

ok this is fair enough, but, i wasnt looking to change the musicallity, since - for me - this defeats the object of doing a game remix. If i want to do something musically technical / different, then i'll write my own music. With regards to the structure, its fairly typical of the type of track it is, (i.e. a simple, somewhat repeative (heaven forbid!) techno-y-breaks track) perhaps i should have put in the filters i had been considering to add to the dynamic and accent the structure of the track, but i liked (although i'm now beginning to regret liking it) the simplicity of the piece.

5) The bass isn't bassy enough, and all the instruments sound far away and unpleasant.

to say unpleasant is IMO a somewhat harsh comment. nothing there grates on the ears. Whilst i cant say how the bass sounds on your speakers, i know it became very boomy on one of my pairs of headphones, so i did reduce it, but you're quite likely right on that one, although frankly - i've heard much worse.

Suggestions would all revolve around more musical content, better mixing, better EQ, better sample choices, better FX...

so you really dont like any of it then? ok - fair enough - you're quite entitled not to, but i'll reserve my right to disagree. yes, i'd love to tighten up the mix a bit, master it properly, try it on various types of monitors, but in the end - it's only a game remix, and i dont intend losing any sleep over it.

and if you want to make this into a drum and bass tune, then study proper drum and bass artists and what they're doing.

Errr no thanks! Drum & Bass is *not* what is intended from this remix. techno / electro / breakbeat - i dont know - but certainly not d&b which quite frankly, although can be very well produced (occasionally) i find to be a rather uninteresting genre.

perhaps in future when i come to write a remix purely for my own enjoyment, i'll keep it to myself.

I only listened to the remix because you asked me to.

I don't quite know what you hoped to accomplish by arguing with every point and then claiming that you were happy with it: it's obvious that no one else is, and that (importantly) it bothered you. No, I didn't like anything about the remix, because most aspects of it seem technically flawed (and musically lite). You gave the impression that you were bothered enough to listen to what people said, but it appears not.

And if you weren't changing the musicality (like, putting in some chords or something, at least), then what were you doing? Regurgitating the original and then basking in reflected glory? What does anyone achieve by this kind of thing except a statement saying "I'm here, love me, love me, pleeeeeeeez"? The implication from your statements here is that your original music is much different: and without knowing you, I've no way to tell between a high-concept piece of retro art to which I've missed the point (i.e. you're skilled enough to have made it sound exactly like this intentionally knowing that it will sound horrible to most listeners), or a general lack of technical skill (which is fine, unless you're not going to learn from people who have those skills, of which there are many on this board).

I haven't voted on Amigaremix.com, but if I had, I would have probably agreed with the majority, who presumably are of the "I don't know art, but I know what I like" persuasion.

[edit]

perhaps in future when i come to write a remix purely for my own enjoyment, i'll keep it to myself.

And in discussions like this, it always comes down to the threat to withdraw your wonderful art from us oh-so-ungrateful members of the listening public. Did you expect me to come back and say "oh, I was so wrong, please don't leave us, we couldn't do without you"? If not, then this was just a classic piece of passive aggressive nonsense which this board could well do without.

Perhaps in future when I'm asked for feedback I'll keep it to myself...


Chris

btw chris, reading my post back, i hope i dont come across as a complete arse...
you're quite right to criticise every element of the track with the reasoning you have, but i just wanted you to understand my reasoning behind the decisions i made when i made this track the way it is.

ok, i obviously didnt put in that second post quite quick enough, and thats blown it.

i'm not after any reflected glory, and i dont expect anyone to give a monkeys whether or not i post tracks or not, that *really* wasnt what i intended to be implied by that last statement, just that i should have been less self-indulgent when writing it!

i'm just sorry that you got *that* impression from me responding to the points in your post, and that you felt the need to think i didnt agree with anything you said, i was just trying to show you my reasoning (which i admit - perhaps i got wrong!)

I honestly wasnt looking just to disagree with you for the sake of it and i appriciate you taking the time to give me your opinion.

HungryHorace wrote:ok, i obviously didnt put in that second post quite quick enough, and thats blown it.

i'm not after any reflected glory, and i dont expect anyone to give a monkeys whether or not i post tracks or not, that *really* wasnt what i intended to be implied by that last statement, just that i should have been less self-indulgent when writing it!

i'm just sorry that you got *that* impression from me responding to the points in your post, and that you felt the need to think i didnt agree with anything you said, i was just trying to show you my reasoning (which i admit - perhaps i got wrong!)

I honestly wasnt looking just to disagree with you for the sake of it and i appriciate you taking the time to give me your opinion.

Well, I am a huge fan of your skiing

Chris Abbott wrote: Well, I am a huge fan of your skiing

good to hear. well i'm glad that ugly misunderstanding is out of the way (that was far more likely to keep me awake at night than the remix tbh!)

so maybe now you've calmed down you can tell me why you said... hehe - just kidding!