Visa Röster's CD: "just a CDR". Balls?

Chris Abbott · Post by **Chris Abbott** » 06/10/2004 - 9:31

OK, I just got a blistering complaint that Visa RÃƒÂ¶ster's CD is only a CDR instead of a pressed audio CD. In fact, they considered they'd "wasted" the money. I'd like to start a discussion about this.

Here's my two penn'orth:

1) It's a limited edition CD of 100 copies. Pressing plants don't press CD runs of less than 500 (unless they press 500 and then throw 300 away, for instance).

2) The CD was only allowed to contain Spy vs Spy on the condition that it was less than 100 copies. Visa RÃƒÂ¶ster has 50, I had 50.

3) Bjorn Lynne and Synsoniq have both been known to sell CDRs of rare, limited or out-of-print material at full price, based on its rarity.

4) This CD release was all about supporting BIT Live by helping stave off impending doom.

5) Isn't it also a little bit about the music ON the CDR?

Frankly, blistering complaints are the last thing I expected

Considered thoughts?

I thought I ought to bring this to the forum, so potential customers know more about the ins and outs of what they're buying.

Chris

Cheetor · Post by **Cheetor** » 06/10/2004 - 9:47

You've got my support 100% on this one Chris.

I've bought CDs from Bjorn before that have been on CD-Rs, mainly those that have been albums that have been game soundtracks that he thought would never sell in the sort of quantities that he needed to go to a full pressing such as Alien Breed 3D.

From a CD-R point of view, I'm considering a CD-R based re-release of an Amiga CD-ROM I produced a few years back for the collectors market. That had a limited production run of 500 when it first came out and there's no way I can afford to have a second full run done again so that would have to be made to order on CD-Rs. Is the product any less valid just because it's on CD-Rs? Of course not?

As you said, it's the music that's important and not the type of CD that it's on. More importantly MORE of the income from each CD will help you to recover the losses from BIT Live from a CD-R than a "regular" CD this time around AND we get a bonus track.

If anyone wants to complain, no-one's forcing them to buy the CD.

Chris Abbott · Post by **Chris Abbott** » 06/10/2004 - 9:54

Well, to be fair, after a chat, the customer concerned has been mollified. I think he was just having a bad day.

Plus I've altered the wording on the site.

Chris

Matrix · Post by **Matrix** » 06/10/2004 - 10:10

Personally i dont give a rats @$$ weather its a CD-R or a PCD, if it holds tracks and plays - WHO CARES !

Vosla · Post by **Vosla** » 06/10/2004 - 13:14

Matrix wrote:Personally i dont give a rats @$$ weather its a CD-R or a PCD, if it holds tracks and plays - WHO CARES !

Could have been my line. CD-R is okay with such a small edition.

Matrix · Post by **Matrix** » 06/10/2004 - 13:37

Well its right init' youre paying for the artists skills and efforts, not the sodding delivery medium - if it works who gives a smeg ! - it could have been on an SD card for me ! - i dont care... long as i can hear it and get my moneys worth out of enjoying it... plus its for a good cause as well.

Picking the difference between a pressed cd and a cdr is just petty imho... its only a tenner, plus if they had bought the rights to the music and had a proper pressing, AND setup a run of say, a thousand, you can be looking at Ã‚Â£20 instead of Ã‚Â£10 for the same end result on your ears.

I think VR and Chris did the RIGHT thing.

Chappers · Post by **Chappers** » 06/10/2004 - 13:50

I remember when I bought the Machinae Supremacy promo CD at a BITLive and that was on a CD-R.

No complaints from me, it was a quality promo album. The fact it was on a CD-R made no difference to me whatsoever. Whatever makes up the contents on the CD is important not what kind of CD it is.

Bad day or not, it's not fair taking it out on Chris when he's making a ball-busting effort to keep the scene alive. More donations to Chris (and the Bitlive fund) would make getting those complaints less of a hassle to deal with, I guess.

I had already donated Ã‚Â£20 to the Bitlive fund before London but I would hope and hazard a guess that there are a few people on this forum who haven't contributed yet *and* have the resources to send some cash for the Bitlive fund. Every penny is vital, especially when you consider that Chris' arse is on the line financially speaking.

Paul

merman · Post by **merman** » 06/10/2004 - 14:56

For the price, I don't think you can complain about getting a CDR. Unless of course the customer in question has a device that won't play CDRs. Even then, that's a rare occurence.

Paul, I know what you mean about donating. I've sent a bit more since the concert, and hopefully the article in RETRO GAMER will raise the profile a bit more and might get Chris some new sales...

madfiddler · Post by **madfiddler** » 06/10/2004 - 19:25

Sorry to disagree here guys, but if I were to go out and pay top dollar for something, I would expect top quality too.. I don't think CDr's are top quality, especially when it comes to durability.

I'm not the guy who complained but I do sorta agree with him here.

At the end of the day, it's VR's choice to burn a limited run of 100, they could easily sell 200 and make the price a little more realistic, and prolly make more cash...

I wish I had bought one at BITLive now.

However, on the other side... if people ARE willing to pay more than the price of a 'normal' CD for something more specialist, perhaps I should get my frigging solo album finished...

One another side... arn't VR donating any profits that Chris makes... to the "Pay Chris back what he's lost fund". In which case, sell em for a fiver, get rid of the limited run thing, and Chris can duplicate them himself...

Thoughts thoughts thoughts.

Let the flame wars begin...

-mark

Chris Abbott · Post by **Chris Abbott** » 06/10/2004 - 19:30

> get rid of the limited run thing
It's a copyright thing with First Star

Chris

Chris Abbott · Post by **Chris Abbott** » 06/10/2004 - 19:33

Anyway, now it's made crystal clear on the site, so people can make an informed value judgement (in all senses of the word!).

Chris

Chris Abbott · Post by **Chris Abbott** » 06/10/2004 - 19:37

> if people ARE willing to pay more than the price of a 'normal'
> CD for something more specialist,
Normal CDs often cost more than we're asking (chart CDs Ã‚Â£14.99 anyone?)... and it's the same price as, say, Instant Remedy.

We're very good value, as a rule.

Now if only every SID fan would buy a CD, we'd be sorted...

Chris

Cheetor · Post by **Cheetor** » 06/10/2004 - 20:13

Yeah, it's amazing how many times some of those remixes have been downloaded over at RKO... just think how many CDs could really be sold if all those people downloading actually the tracks bought the CDs as well or even just bought one of the CDs!

weblaus · Post by **weblaus** » 06/10/2004 - 20:28

I actually didn't think about the possibility of the album being a CDR when I ordered it, but in that case I don't mind: it's clearly a "home-made" production (very well and professionally done, though), so it's okay for me.

What I strongly object to is when professional albums are sold on CDR for inflated prices (personally, I wouldn't touch Synsoniq with a 10-feet-pole, and not only because of this). If I pay full money for that, I expect full quality, including the type of media I'm getting - no matter how "rare" or whatever the album might be.

What I don't get is the First Star thing, though: I know there pretty anal on their copyrights, but Spy vs. Spy is no way that great a song to let yourself be bossed around. There' a lot of stuff on the CD that's (to me, anyway) a lot stronger and it's a shame if there won't be more copies around because of an arrogant has-been-company...

Ulrich.

Cheetor · Post by **Cheetor** » 06/10/2004 - 20:36

From my understanding, the CD will be re-pressed as a professional quality CD in the future but without the Spy vs Spy track which is only the limited edition CD-R version which has had to be limited to 100 copies.

As that won't be on the future release of the album, there won't be any restrictions on the quantity released.

Visa Röster's CD: "just a CDR". Balls?

Visa RÃƒÂ¶ster's CD: "just a CDR". Balls?

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