Commodore Remix

wazzaw wrote:But please, folks, think twice about adding a vocal to a remix for the sake of it.

I'd like to add: If you want to please wazzaw, that is. If you want to please me, do whatever YOU like to do. There are a lot of opinions and wishes, and the only one you should please (as long as you're not trying to sell anything and get rich or die trying) is yourself.

wazzaw wrote:The originals were instrumental for a good reason. Let's not forget that.

They were instrumental because there was no way you could fit non-repetitive sampled voices into 62kB of memory. Nowadays (where I live) that technological limit is gone and so are the creative limits in making music.

That's my 2 cents!

There's alot of excellent comments coming up here. And to be honest it's made me think a little. Especially the words of Mahonney and Lman who both have made me think about things as a bigger picture.

At the end of the day, its all about enjoying what you do, and having fun along the way. if others enjoy your work then thats a bonus.

Pex `Mahoney` Tufvesson wrote:I'd like to add: If you want to please wazzaw, that is. If you want to please me, do whatever YOU like to do.

I don't want to stop creative forces, Mahoney. I can even remember your C64 SID output with some fond memories back in the day, and some of those were purely for lots and lots of fun. Indeed, I've even liked some of your pieces you've done with vocals on (which I mentioned in my post).

You're your own person. You do what comes naturally. Hell, I'm not the one that wants to stop that. All I'm asking is that if someone (whoever it is, not directed at you) is going to add vocals to a remix, pleasethink whether it's actually going to enhance the piece or not. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. It's up to the remixer to decide.

wazzaw wrote:It's up to the remixer to decide.

Ok, I didn't understand that from what you wrote. Sorry.

Vocals need a lot more care and attention to make them work. On one level you've got a Crazy Comets remix with the Mega Apocalypse "Get Ready" sample. And that works (most of the time). Humorous lyrics in a Makke style also work on one level.
But as Warren says (az Waz sayz ), not all tunes are suited to having vocals mixed in.

merman wrote:But as Warren says (az Waz sayz ), not all tunes are suited to having vocals mixed in.

I must disagree... Any SID is suited to have lyrics in them, every single one... It's a matter of how it's done...
I was originally involved in the Sweet project that Markus and Mahoney made but I had to drop out due to personal reasons. I think the track is brilliant and the lyrics inthere work very very well...
It's all in the eye of the beholder. The way LaLa and Waz invision Sweet lyrics done the way Mahoney and Markus has done them is out of the question and does not work any way, shape or form... To me they do though... Like I said any SID is suited for lyrics but personal preferences may differ and limit ways for some listeners... Eye of the beholder...

Wellllll... vocals in "Sweet" may not work for you, but it works for me (and obviously, for others too). Obviously this sweet tune polarises a lot, which is okay. But this is starting to seem as if Markus & Pex actually owed the desired ultimate cover of "Sweet" to the world.

You have the right to say you don't like the mixes and why, but telling the arranger "You have done that wrong" has no point, since from a different point of view he may have done everything absolutely right.

Take it a little more easy everyone, please.

- Markus

Larsec wrote:I must disagree... Any SID is suited to have lyrics in them, every single one...

Hehe 2 minds 1 thought

LMan / Remix64 wrote:Hehe 2 minds 1 thought

This is a generalisation
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Sometimes this place feels like whine64 not remix64. Its all so easy to disagree and argue and criticise, but is it too hard to actually give someone a pat on the back every now and then...

People have birthdays, why not give them a birthday hi... Even if you don't know them, its always nice to recieve. People ask for feedback and opinions on beta tunes, why not give them a hand and suggest things.

I know many of you do, but there's a heck of a lot more who don't.

Nothing wrong with with disagreing a point or arguing a case i admit, but i'd like to see more of a balance around here.

Fersando came on these boards several days ago asking for opinions, so very few people actually bothered... Lets ALL try and balance it all out a bit.

LMan / Remix64 wrote:But this is starting to seem as if Markus & Pex actually owed the desired ultimate cover of "Sweet" to the world.

Hopefully not from me. They owe nothing to no one. How they wish to do things is their own choice. Whether I like it or not is my choice. I usually give a pretty good reason why I don't like a certain tune. For me, it was down to the fact that I felt the tune lost its emotion somewhat and didn't convey the feelings to me, and that's all it was. That's nothing against anyone, as I mentioned before, had anyone else done the remix exactly the same way, I'd have voiced the same opinion.

But that's just me, it didn't hit me the same way as others. Others like it lots. Fair enough too.

You have to bear in mind also that maybe I'm of a different mindset than most. You see, with my collection being so varied and full of different ranges and styles, I have built a view over the last fifteen years on what comprises a good composition and what doesn't , and also why. My view isn't blinkered, and I always appreciate new ideas and thoughts into creative processes to expand that view. For example, take Blacksmoke's recent DIY EP. Most people would hate it, yet I liked the fact it was challenging convention, very loud and also controversial.

For a remixer, I believe it works in two ways: inspiration and perspiration. Inspiration because of the original SID, and perspiration being the bloody hard work they do (which we all appreciate). I don't wish to demerit that just because it wasn't to my taste, but maybe be constructive and express just what it was that didn't work. Those who accept constructive criticism take it on board and better themselves, and I'm sure if nothing else discussions like these can only help in the longer term so that we all go home happy (well, that's the theory anyway).

Apologies if I've offended anyone, but hopefully you can all appreciate that you can't please all of the people all of the time.

C'mon boys, that's becoming really childish...

I read things like "mix like those ruins the scene".
Or like "add a vocal and the track is ruined".

...(not 1:1 words, just the meaning)...

Stop it, please.
There are bad remixes and good remixes.

And that is a very subjective and personal vision. All matter of tastes.
I can agree with someone when he says "i don't like this because..".
I get really pissed when i read "Statements from the High" in how a mix should be or shouldn't be, and what are the consequences for the mankind if a mix don't follows the "Statements from the High".

Technical and composition errors are errors.

But, in the tastes side.... tastes are tastes.

Re vocals on remix: one of my favourites is the Commando highscore by N-Joy of TSW - sometimes I hum it to myself and almost forget which song it was from the beginning. To me, the voice is an instrument like all the others, only that we understand the "tone" on a deeper level than we understand the tone of a guitar, oboe or Moog synth. If anyone did a remix featuring bees, dogs or shouting monkeys, how would that be received in this community?

Reyn's remix of "Insects in Space" went down OK

Chris

Also, opinions are opinions, but they're not all equal. I respect opinions that are based on a thorough knowledge of the issues and thought, not half-baked, inherited, stereotypical, received wisdom, kneejerk claptrap, and especially when such opinions are held even when proved wrong by facts. And it's depressing how many opinions manage to survive a factual beating-up and become more entrenched.

Of course, this has nothing in particular to do with this thread: just saying that not all opinions are equal, and a hell of a lot of them are only there to act as placeholders for rational thought.

* disclaimer *
This post was not engendered by any poster in this thread. I'm just in a really bad mood about humanity right now.
* end disclaimer *